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Windows 8

Discussion and questions about Cumulus weather station software version 1. This section and its subforums are the main place to get help with Cumulus. Anything which is not specific to the type of weather station goes in here; for anything specific to a type of weather station, please use the appropriate subforum. Use the 'website development' section for any questions relating to creating or running a web site for Cumulus data. Discussion of the stations themselves in these sections is fine.

Will you be running Cumulus on Windows 8?

Yes, definitely
102
43%
No, definitely not
102
43%
I'm undecided
34
14%
 
Total votes: 238

User avatar
dane
Posts: 410
Joined: Wed 10 Sep 2008 2:15 pm
Weather Station: Rosenborg 68700
Operating System: Win10 Ult., 64-bit, RaspberryPi
Location: Gilleleje, Denmark

Re: Windows 8

Post by dane » Wed 05 Dec 2012 9:25 pm

Installed Win8 recently (dual boot configuration).
Cumulus runs without any problems at all.

Microsoft has stopped desktop gadget support. But if you install http://8gadgetpack.bplaced.net/ you may install my cumulusih package to get the familiar Cumulus desktop realtime gadget.

To boot straight into the desktop you may want to install the free program from http://www.iobit.com/iobitstartmenu8.php
Ib

User avatar
Buford T. Justice
Posts: 385
Joined: Fri 17 Aug 2012 9:21 pm
Weather Station: Ambient Weather WS-2902A
Operating System: Windows 10 Pro 64-bit
Location: USA

Re: Windows 8

Post by Buford T. Justice » Wed 19 Dec 2012 2:05 pm

I saw a few posts about antivirus. I like COMODO Internet Security 6 which works very well with Windows 8 and previous version of Windows...

http://forums.comodo.com/news-announcem ... 185.0.html

In Windows 8, open Microsoft Security Essentials and go to its options and you should be able to turn it off. Also turn the Windows 8 firewall off as CIS comes with a superior one. Be sure to go to CUSTOMIZE INSTALLER and uncheck Dragon and GeekBuddy unless you feel a need to want them.
Last edited by Buford T. Justice on Tue 01 Jan 2013 7:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

dsouter
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon 02 Jan 2012 8:28 pm
Weather Station: WH1081
Operating System: Windows 7
Location: Lockerbie

Re: Windows 8

Post by dsouter » Tue 01 Jan 2013 5:31 pm

Windows 8 seems to be confusing itself. seems to want to jump between win 7 type environment and win 8. Cumulus works fine for me on win 8 though - no installation issues

peterh
Posts: 150
Joined: Fri 21 Dec 2012 1:08 pm
Weather Station: Alecto WS-5000 rebadged FO 3081
Operating System: Windows server 2008R2
Location: Nederland

Re: Windows 8

Post by peterh » Tue 01 Jan 2013 8:30 pm

I'm running Cumulus on a server (it needs to be up pretty much 24/7). Hence Windows 2008R2. I may upgrade to Windows 2012 in the near future.

Re: Windows 8: the best reason I can think of to upgrade to Windows 8 is simple:
<ClarksonMode>
POWERRRRRRRRR!
</ClarksonMode>

Windows 8 is much faster than Windows 7. My NC10 netbook starts up from a complete shutdown as fast as it resumes from hibernation: 16 seconds.
(ok, ok... it has 2 gb ram and a 256 GB SSD. Having said that, Windows 8 is ruddy quick.)

Having said that and that, I don't run Windows 8 on my desktop yet, as this is my main development machine and I don't want to mess with that.

<rant><dream>
I'd appreciate an architecture in which there is a CumulusAgent that runs as a service, which does the data collection and the web stuff, stores the data in a database, and does daily maintenance and logging... and then a CumulusClient that merely queries the database (preferably through Entity Framework since that abstracts the data layer and allows us to, without code changes in the application layer, support multiple database platforms) and does UI stuff, which could then run on a separate machine.
Even better, if a CumulusServer would serve up the data (saved by the CumulusAgent) through a web service, you could even do the client in PHP (wtf?), or come up with iPhone and Android UI's without any code changes on the agent side. The agent would then not be bothered with any UI stuff.
And the Cumulus Web Publishing Service and the Wunderground service could use the same interface, acting as a client of the CumulusServer service.
Much more flexible, way easier to maintain over OS versions, and much easier to expand.
</dream></rant>
An opinion should be the result of a thought process, not a substitution.
http://www.dnl-core.net/CothenWeather/

BCJKiwi
Posts: 869
Joined: Mon 09 Jul 2012 8:40 pm
Weather Station: Davis VP2 Cabled with Solar
Operating System: Windows 10 Pro
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Contact:

Re: Windows 8

Post by BCJKiwi » Tue 01 Jan 2013 8:44 pm

Well if you run a web server on your local lan then you can have all that right now.

Run Cumulus minimised and autostart - OK I know that is not running as a service but is near enough.
Cumulus copies all the web stuff as normal to your local webserver.
There are utilities to extract the data and write it to SQL if you really need a database.
Run the Cumulus or Saratoga (or homebrew) websites and you have what you are asking for.

Your browser is your client, (or VNC/RDP) to interact directly with Cumulus.

peterh
Posts: 150
Joined: Fri 21 Dec 2012 1:08 pm
Weather Station: Alecto WS-5000 rebadged FO 3081
Operating System: Windows server 2008R2
Location: Nederland

Re: Windows 8

Post by peterh » Tue 01 Jan 2013 10:45 pm

BCJKiwi wrote:Run Cumulus minimised and autostart - OK I know that is not running as a service but is near enough.
Not even close to near enough. When I log off from the server console, Cumulus terminates. No web site updates, and Wunderground is left in the dark as well.
When the server restarts but nobody logs on, Cumulus does not start. No web site updates, and Wunderground is left in the dark as well.
Cumulus cannot run under a service account - it can only run in the user context of the logged-on user.
BCJKiwi wrote:Cumulus copies all the web stuff as normal to your local webserver.
If you have a local web server, and only if Cumulus runs.
BCJKiwi wrote:There are utilities to extract the data and write it to SQL if you really need a database.
You make it sound as if needing a database is a Bad Thing(TM). From an architectural point of view, that is just stupid.
You are a software developer, and you want to work with structured data? The phrase "structured data" is your cue: you really need a database. If you are going to store structured data in a flat text-file system, you're not just shooting yourself in the foot... in the long run, you're blowing your whole leg off. Structured data is so much easier to access (for a developer) and faster to access (for anyone else) than text files that have to be parsed...
BCJKiwi wrote:Run the Cumulus or Saratoga (or homebrew) websites and you have what you are asking for.
Your browser is your client, (or VNC/RDP) to interact directly with Cumulus.
You seem to be missing my point... mainly because you are looking from a different perspective.
From a USER perspective, I am quite happy with Cumulus. When it runs, it does what I want it to do, and support is a lot better than you would expect from donationware.

From an administrator perspective, I'd say that Cumulus is hard to administer. You'd be aiming at close to 24/7 availability, but that is hard to accomplish.

From a maintenance perspective... well, let's put it this way: if Cumulus would be built in a multi-tier architecture, it would be a lot easier to maintain and expand.
An opinion should be the result of a thought process, not a substitution.
http://www.dnl-core.net/CothenWeather/

BCJKiwi
Posts: 869
Joined: Mon 09 Jul 2012 8:40 pm
Weather Station: Davis VP2 Cabled with Solar
Operating System: Windows 10 Pro
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Contact:

Re: Windows 8

Post by BCJKiwi » Wed 02 Jan 2013 1:02 am

Whoa, don't shoot the messenger.
I did indicate that I understood running minimised is not the same as a service.
I also said IF you have a local webserver.
I have no idea why you would think I don't like Databases - see some of my other posts on this forum. I fully agree re structered data etc.
I'll refrain from further comment.

peterh
Posts: 150
Joined: Fri 21 Dec 2012 1:08 pm
Weather Station: Alecto WS-5000 rebadged FO 3081
Operating System: Windows server 2008R2
Location: Nederland

Re: Windows 8

Post by peterh » Wed 02 Jan 2013 6:16 am

BCJKiwi wrote:Whoa, don't shoot the messenger.
If what I wrote came across like that, I'm sorry. :oops: I did not intend to shoot the messenger... I just disagreed with the message.

What you describe is a working setup for an individual.
What I described was a pipe dream: a multi-tiered set of components communicating through a documented interface. Sounds a bit 'enterprisey', but there is a method in the madness.
An opinion should be the result of a thought process, not a substitution.
http://www.dnl-core.net/CothenWeather/

User avatar
steve
Cumulus Author
Posts: 26714
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Weather Station: None
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Location: Vienne, France
Contact:

Re: Windows 8

Post by steve » Wed 02 Jan 2013 9:24 am

peterh wrote:I'd appreciate an architecture in which there is a CumulusAgent that runs as a service, which does the data collection and the web stuff, stores the data in a database, and does daily maintenance and logging... and then a CumulusClient that merely queries the database
That's how the defunct Cumulus 2 worked. It didn't prove possible to keep developing it.
Steve

peterh
Posts: 150
Joined: Fri 21 Dec 2012 1:08 pm
Weather Station: Alecto WS-5000 rebadged FO 3081
Operating System: Windows server 2008R2
Location: Nederland

Re: Windows 8

Post by peterh » Wed 02 Jan 2013 1:02 pm

D'oh! :shock:

Anything we can do to breathe life into that? :cry:
An opinion should be the result of a thought process, not a substitution.
http://www.dnl-core.net/CothenWeather/

User avatar
steve
Cumulus Author
Posts: 26714
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Weather Station: None
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Contact:

Re: Windows 8

Post by steve » Wed 02 Jan 2013 1:29 pm

peterh wrote:Anything we can do to breathe life into that? :cry:
Days with more than 24 hours in them? Enough money to pay me to retire from my day job so that I can spend even more time on Cumulus than the already ridiculous amount of time I spend already?

But in any case, the architecture of Cumulus 2 was not popular with the majority of users.
Steve

gemini06720
Posts: 1700
Joined: Mon 10 Aug 2009 10:16 pm
Weather Station: No weather station
Operating System: No operating system
Location: World...

Re: Windows 8

Post by gemini06720 » Thu 03 Jan 2013 9:12 am

peterh wrote:Re: Windows 8: the best reason I can think of to upgrade to Windows 8 is simple:
<ClarksonMode>
POWERRRRRRRRR!
</ClarksonMode>

Windows 8 is much faster than Windows 7. My NC10 netbook starts up from a complete shutdown as fast as it resumes from hibernation: 16 seconds.
(ok, ok... it has 2 gb ram and a 256 GB SSD. Having said that, Windows 8 is ruddy quick.)
According to the experts (and my own limited personal experiments) Windows 8 not faster than a clean/new installation of Windows 7.

For example, you claimed that Windows 8 was faster at starting up. Well, it should! Here are quotes from Fred Langa in a recently published article at/on Windows Secrets:
  • "It’s normal behavior for Win8. By default, that operating system’s core never shuts down all the way! It’s part of a new feature — fast startup.

    When you issue a standard power-down command to Win8, it carries out a hybrid shutdown. Win8 first closes and terminates all user sessions in the expected way. Next, it copies what’s still running in RAM (primarily, the live core of the operating system — the system kernel) onto the hard drive. It then turns off the system hardware.

    When Win8 starts up after a hybrid shutdown, it performs a hybrid boot. As soon as the hardware’s ready, the core of the OS reloads from the hard drive; Win8 then picks up right from where it left off. Thus, the OS itself is up and ready to go in a flash. You still have to reload your apps and data the normal way, from scratch."
That is why Windows 8 'appears' to be faster... ;)

Now, please, do not quote me as saying/writing that Windows 8 is not a good operating software - it is no better nor worst than Windows 7 which has probably been the best operating system ever released by Microsoft ... ever.

User avatar
steve
Cumulus Author
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Re: Windows 8

Post by steve » Thu 03 Jan 2013 9:31 am

gemini06720 wrote:It’s part of a new feature — fast startup.
This was the feature I had to disable, or my PC wouldn't shut down.
Steve

gemini06720
Posts: 1700
Joined: Mon 10 Aug 2009 10:16 pm
Weather Station: No weather station
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Location: World...

Re: Windows 8

Post by gemini06720 » Thu 03 Jan 2013 9:40 am

But, but, Steve, look at it this way ... if the PC cannot be shut down ... then the PC is already ready to be used ... thus near instant hybrid shutdown/hybrid boot ... just one of the many benefits of Windows 8... :mrgreen:

User avatar
steve
Cumulus Author
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Re: Windows 8

Post by steve » Thu 03 Jan 2013 9:48 am

Yes, indeed. I did consider just leaving it switched on, it's on for around 16 hours a day anyway. But it becomes a problem when needing a restart after updates, so I turned the facility off.
Steve

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