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Latest Cumulus MX V3 release 3.28.6 (build 3283) - 21 March 2024
Cumulus MX V4 beta test release 4.0.0 (build 4017) - 17 March 2024
Legacy Cumulus 1 release v1.9.4 (build 1099) - 28 November 2014 (a patch is available for 1.9.4 build 1099 that extends the date range of drop-down menus to 2030)
Download the Software (Cumulus MX / Cumulus 1 and other related items) from the Wiki
Lost Sensor Contact!!
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- Posts: 1885
- Joined: Sat 21 Feb 2009 12:41 pm
- Weather Station: Nothing working ATM - making one
- Operating System: OS X, Linux Mint, Win7 & XP
- Location: Devon UK
Re: Lost Sensor Contact!!
Re-connected wind sensors at 0940 (16 Apr 2010) and almost immediately got a spike! I'll leave it a few hours and see if there's another.
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Gina
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
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- Posts: 127
- Joined: Wed 27 Jan 2010 11:28 am
- Weather Station: Watson W-8261
- Operating System: XP
- Location: NE7 7QE Newcastle upon Tyne UK
Re: Lost Sensor Contact!!
Could the socket be a bit dodgy?
You could try connecting a spare bit of phone lead with an rj11 plug on it and see if the lead is picking up interference. In the somewhat unlikely case that it is that, you can probably solve it by winding the lead around a ferrite ring near the transmitter socket. If you have a ferrite ring handy you could do that right away. If you have a long lead like I do with the wind apparatus up in the air and the temp sensors and transmitter down below, you have a pretty good hf antenna going up the pole and possibly conducting unexpected voltages into the kit.
If it isn't that, maybe there is some fault in the anemometer or in the wind vane.
You are definitely getting close to the cause now.
You could try connecting a spare bit of phone lead with an rj11 plug on it and see if the lead is picking up interference. In the somewhat unlikely case that it is that, you can probably solve it by winding the lead around a ferrite ring near the transmitter socket. If you have a ferrite ring handy you could do that right away. If you have a long lead like I do with the wind apparatus up in the air and the temp sensors and transmitter down below, you have a pretty good hf antenna going up the pole and possibly conducting unexpected voltages into the kit.
If it isn't that, maybe there is some fault in the anemometer or in the wind vane.
You are definitely getting close to the cause now.
My weather data page on WU:
http://www.wunderground.com/weatherstat ... =INEWCAST6
http://www.wunderground.com/weatherstat ... =INEWCAST6
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- Posts: 1885
- Joined: Sat 21 Feb 2009 12:41 pm
- Weather Station: Nothing working ATM - making one
- Operating System: OS X, Linux Mint, Win7 & XP
- Location: Devon UK
Re: Lost Sensor Contact!!
No more spikes as yet - just ups and down as the sun comes out and goes in. My home made screen has reduced the effect of solar radiation from 2-3 degrees to less than 1 but it needs the aspirating fan (currently not connected) to reduce it further. It seems that interference is being picked up by the cables so I'm going to get some clip-on ferrite beads.
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Gina
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
-
- Posts: 1885
- Joined: Sat 21 Feb 2009 12:41 pm
- Weather Station: Nothing working ATM - making one
- Operating System: OS X, Linux Mint, Win7 & XP
- Location: Devon UK
Re: Lost Sensor Contact!!
I agree that the pole and cable is a pretty good hf receiving aerial and I do think that's likely to be the problem. The pole is 6.3m (about 20ft) high and the cable is taped to it in several places but leaves it about 4 or 5ft above ground to go across to the tx unit. This would tap off anything received by the pole. The fact of the pole being grounded at the bottom end would not really help, depending on the wavelength of the interference.EvilV wrote:Could the socket be a bit dodgy?
You could try connecting a spare bit of phone lead with an rj11 plug on it and see if the lead is picking up interference. In the somewhat unlikely case that it is that, you can probably solve it by winding the lead around a ferrite ring near the transmitter socket. If you have a ferrite ring handy you could do that right away. If you have a long lead like I do with the wind apparatus up in the air and the temp sensors and transmitter down below, you have a pretty good hf antenna going up the pole and possibly conducting unexpected voltages into the kit.
If it isn't that, maybe there is some fault in the anemometer or in the wind vane.
You are definitely getting close to the cause now.
I've checked the RJ11 plug at the tx unit and it seems OK but I've tied the cable so that it can't move in the wind.
There is one major source of interference but that is transmitting all the time AFAIK. We are about a mile or so from the Stockland Hill TV and DAB radio transmitter, on the next hill. I think this transmits 200KW at UHF.
Gina
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
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- Posts: 1885
- Joined: Sat 21 Feb 2009 12:41 pm
- Weather Station: Nothing working ATM - making one
- Operating System: OS X, Linux Mint, Win7 & XP
- Location: Devon UK
Re: Lost Sensor Contact!!
Haven't got any ferrite rings but have found a ferrite aerial (LW/MW radio) and I've wrapped the cable several times round that - don't know it it'll work. I've also re-connected the fan. Time of mods 14:40. Plot of temperature to date attached.
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Gina
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
-
- Posts: 1885
- Joined: Sat 21 Feb 2009 12:41 pm
- Weather Station: Nothing working ATM - making one
- Operating System: OS X, Linux Mint, Win7 & XP
- Location: Devon UK
Re: Lost Sensor Contact!!
Just to confirm when the spikes started, here's a temperature (only) plot over the last fortnight.
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Gina
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
-
- Posts: 1885
- Joined: Sat 21 Feb 2009 12:41 pm
- Weather Station: Nothing working ATM - making one
- Operating System: OS X, Linux Mint, Win7 & XP
- Location: Devon UK
Re: Lost Sensor Contact!!
16:50 disconnected wind sensors cable and connected fan. Wrapping the wind sensor cable several times round a ferrite rod aerial didn't help - got a spike.
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Gina
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
-
- Posts: 127
- Joined: Wed 27 Jan 2010 11:28 am
- Weather Station: Watson W-8261
- Operating System: XP
- Location: NE7 7QE Newcastle upon Tyne UK
Re: Lost Sensor Contact!!
I found something which says that the Stockland Hill transmitter puts out 30KW of Freeview signal. I don't know what else is coming out of there. However, since TV transmissions are pretty much continuous I doubt they would account for occasional spikes like you are getting.Gina wrote: There is one major source of interference but that is transmitting all the time AFAIK. We are about a mile or so from the Stockland Hill TV and DAB radio transmitter, on the next hill. I think this transmits 200KW at UHF.
http://www.ukfree.tv/txdetail.php?a=ST222014
I'd favour some erratic electrical source like a big motor switching on or a bad relay in some equipment that sends out wideband radio noise. Do you have any high voltage power lines near? Maybe occasional arcing in a power line insulator could do it.
Maybe to isolate the actual wind instruments, you could disconnect the instruments up at the top of the pole (assuming you're just running a pluggable extension down the pole) but leaving the long wire connected at the bottom. This would allow it to operate as a receiving antenna, if it is doing, and you wouldn't have confusion from the anemometer or the direction indicator.
I'm not sure if a ferrite rod with a few winds would be as effective as a proper ferrite ring. I think the flux is greater in a ring, but I'm not sure about that, and if it is wideband noise at low frequencies, a ferrite ring might not stop it.
There could still be some component failure in the wind instruments.
Personally, I'd leave the fan disconnected for the time being. No sense in having a more complex situation then you have to in a case like this until the problem is finally nailed.
My weather data page on WU:
http://www.wunderground.com/weatherstat ... =INEWCAST6
http://www.wunderground.com/weatherstat ... =INEWCAST6
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- Posts: 1885
- Joined: Sat 21 Feb 2009 12:41 pm
- Weather Station: Nothing working ATM - making one
- Operating System: OS X, Linux Mint, Win7 & XP
- Location: Devon UK
Re: Lost Sensor Contact!!
Thanks. I was a bit wrong there.EvilV wrote:I found something which says that the Stockland Hill transmitter puts out 30KW of Freeview signal. I don't know what else is coming out of there. However, since TV transmissions are pretty much continuous I doubt they would account for occasional spikes like you are getting.
http://www.ukfree.tv/txdetail.php?a=ST222014
Yes, I thought that. The nearest overhead power lines are around 100 yards/metres and 11Kv. The 240v supply is overhead, on poles.I'd favour some erratic electrical source like a big motor switching on or a bad relay in some equipment that sends out wideband radio noise. Do you have any high voltage power lines near? Maybe occasional arcing in a power line insulator could do it.
The cable attached to the wind vane unit reaches down to about halfway down the mast (3m) where there is a female/female coupler, then my extension cable goes down the mast and across to the tx unit (about 5ft above ground). I can disconnect at the coupler. I think disconnecting the wind sensors half way up the mast should still be an effective test as the cable is taped closely to the mast and there should be plenty of capacitive coupling from mast to cable.Maybe to isolate the actual wind instruments, you could disconnect the instruments up at the top of the pole (assuming you're just running a pluggable extension down the pole) but leaving the long wire connected at the bottom. This would allow it to operate as a receiving antenna, if it is doing, and you wouldn't have confusion from the anemometer or the direction indicator.
No, I didn't think a rod would be as good and it proved of no benefit at all. If a ferrite bead doesn't stop it I'm thinking of putting LC filters in all 4 wires near the tx unit and running the common capacitor connection to earth with a wire down to an earth spike.I'm not sure if a ferrite rod with a few winds would be as effective as a proper ferrite ring. I think the flux is greater in a ring, but I'm not sure about that, and if it is wideband noise at low frequencies, a ferrite ring might not stop it.
The fan has been connected and running all night and there have been no spikes. Both wind sensors and rain gauge cables were unplugged from the tx unit. So I think I have eliminated the fan as the source of interference.Personally, I'd leave the fan disconnected for the time being. No sense in having a more complex situation then you have to in a case like this until the problem is finally nailed.
Gina
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
-
- Posts: 1885
- Joined: Sat 21 Feb 2009 12:41 pm
- Weather Station: Nothing working ATM - making one
- Operating System: OS X, Linux Mint, Win7 & XP
- Location: Devon UK
Re: Lost Sensor Contact!!
10:30 17 Apr 2010 Connected rain gauge at tx unit
11:50 17 Apr 2010 Connected wind sensors again
13:00 17 Apr 2010 Disconnected wind sensors. Connected another RJ11 cable wound round wind sensor cable and mast.
As soon as I reconnected the wind sensors I got a spike. I haven't got time to lower the mast and re-erect it ATM so have taken another RJ11 cable (from an old modem - 4 wire) and plugged that into the wind socket on the TX unit. Then wrapped it around the wind sensor cable and round the mast for a couple of feet. So wind sensors not connected but some capacitive coupling between the sensor cable to the test cable.
11:50 17 Apr 2010 Connected wind sensors again
13:00 17 Apr 2010 Disconnected wind sensors. Connected another RJ11 cable wound round wind sensor cable and mast.
As soon as I reconnected the wind sensors I got a spike. I haven't got time to lower the mast and re-erect it ATM so have taken another RJ11 cable (from an old modem - 4 wire) and plugged that into the wind socket on the TX unit. Then wrapped it around the wind sensor cable and round the mast for a couple of feet. So wind sensors not connected but some capacitive coupling between the sensor cable to the test cable.
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Gina
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
-
- Posts: 1885
- Joined: Sat 21 Feb 2009 12:41 pm
- Weather Station: Nothing working ATM - making one
- Operating System: OS X, Linux Mint, Win7 & XP
- Location: Devon UK
Re: Lost Sensor Contact!!
Not seen any spikes since using the separate cable (except maybe a very small one early on).
Here's photos of the cable arrangement.You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Gina
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
-
- Posts: 1885
- Joined: Sat 21 Feb 2009 12:41 pm
- Weather Station: Nothing working ATM - making one
- Operating System: OS X, Linux Mint, Win7 & XP
- Location: Devon UK
Re: Lost Sensor Contact!!
Got a spike now! That seems to confirm that the cable/mast is picking up interference and transferring it to the temperature circuit, which is adjacent to the wind socket. Now it seems a matter of suppression. Either a ferrite bead on the cable or a choke and capacitor on each incoming line.
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Gina
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
-
- Posts: 1885
- Joined: Sat 21 Feb 2009 12:41 pm
- Weather Station: Nothing working ATM - making one
- Operating System: OS X, Linux Mint, Win7 & XP
- Location: Devon UK
Re: Lost Sensor Contact!!
I'm thinking of the following, from Maplin :-
Clip on ferrite beads - http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=32799
Order........Part..........Max.........Max...........Min........Attenuation (Ω)
Code........number.....diameter...length......hole dia.....25 MHz.....100MHz
N95AB.....HEM3018.....20.50.......36............6.5.........120............190
All dimensions are in mm.
RF Chokes - http://www.maplin.co.uk/module.aspx?moduleno=3660
I was thinking of the 1mH one with the idea that the higher the value the better. Probably used with a 0.1uF ceramic capacitor. The circuit would connect to the TX unit with a short RJ11 cable and for the earth I was thinking of a wire from the circuit, down the post to an earth spike in the ground.
Does this sound sensible, EvilV? (or anyone else au fait with this subject)
Clip on ferrite beads - http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=32799
Order........Part..........Max.........Max...........Min........Attenuation (Ω)
Code........number.....diameter...length......hole dia.....25 MHz.....100MHz
N95AB.....HEM3018.....20.50.......36............6.5.........120............190
All dimensions are in mm.
RF Chokes - http://www.maplin.co.uk/module.aspx?moduleno=3660
I was thinking of the 1mH one with the idea that the higher the value the better. Probably used with a 0.1uF ceramic capacitor. The circuit would connect to the TX unit with a short RJ11 cable and for the earth I was thinking of a wire from the circuit, down the post to an earth spike in the ground.
Does this sound sensible, EvilV? (or anyone else au fait with this subject)
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Last edited by Gina on Sat 17 Apr 2010 9:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Gina
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
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- Posts: 556
- Joined: Fri 08 May 2009 3:12 pm
- Weather Station: Davis Vantage Vue
- Operating System: Windows 10
- Location: Pembrokeshire West Wales UK
- Contact:
Re: Lost Sensor Contact!!
Hey Gina ..... Come over here and rewire my house for me whan you've finished!Gina wrote:I'm thinking of the following, from Maplin :-
Clip on ferrite beads - http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=32799
Order........Part..........Max.........Max...........Min........Attenuation (Ω)
Code........number.....diameter...length......hole dia.....25 MHz.....100MHz
N95AB.....HEM3018.....20.50.......36............6.5.........120............190
All dimensions are in mm.
RF Chokes - http://www.maplin.co.uk/module.aspx?moduleno=3660
I was thinking of the 1Mh one with the idea that the higher the value the better. Probably used with a 0.1uF ceramic capacitor. The circuit would connect to the TX unit with a short RJ11 cable and for the earth I was thinking of a wire from the circuit, down the post to an earth spike in the ground.
Does this sound sensible, EvilV? (or anyone else au fait with this subject)
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- Posts: 1885
- Joined: Sat 21 Feb 2009 12:41 pm
- Weather Station: Nothing working ATM - making one
- Operating System: OS X, Linux Mint, Win7 & XP
- Location: Devon UK
Re: Lost Sensor Contact!!
geoffw wrote:Hey Gina ..... Come over here and rewire my house for me whan you've finished!
Up to date temperature only plot :-
Gina
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.
Sorry, no banner - weather station out of action. Hoping to be up and running with a new home-made one soon.